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Talk:Morningstar
Another description to fix. From the Morningstar page: "NWN prevented morningstars from being used in the off-hand, NWN2 does not have this restriction." Well this weapon isn't a chained weapon, ie. morningstar. Its a mace with a spiked head, so you can use it in the off hand. The actual morningstar, otherwise called a flail cannot be used in the off hand. So the restriction is correct, just the wrong weapon. Ragimund (talk) 13:55, January 4, 2020 (UTC) So, a Morningstar has a chain tether. Looks like I'm holding a club here with spikes on the head. The other is a flanged mace and not much different, a little less damage and weight. Both simple weapons but a chain weapon probably isn't simple to use, maybe martial training. Yes, its a spiked mace incorrectly given the morningstar description and what is called a flail is actually a morningstar. Another minor issue is that D&D give this piercing and blunt damage. https://imgur.com/9Cr6qAW Ragimund (talk) 15:41, January 4, 2020 (UTC) In NWN, it was very bad for a weapon to have multiple damage types (very very bad) but in NWN2, it's actually not bad anymore. For example, skeletons have damage reduction 5/bludgeoning. Morningstars (well, what the game calls morningstars) are able to beat the damage reduction because they include bludgeoning damage. Similarly, halberds (which have piercing and slashing damage) beat zombies' damage reduction 5/slashing. So I would count this as one of the things that NWN did really poorly (halberds were really bad in that game because of this) but NWN2 did correctly. In NWN, damage types could be resisted so halberds were resisted by piercing resistance and slashing resistance. HolyGuardian80 (talk) 03:48, January 5, 2020 (UTC) I disagree with giving morningstars piercing damage but maybe that's how to make it slightly better weapon than a spiked mace, I'd rather better crit range. But this is a mace so the piercing damage is on the wrong weapon. Ragimund (talk) I've solved the piercing issue, assume the spiked mace has a long spike on top (but flanged maces can also have the long spike on top). Ragimund (talk) I always imagine the morningstar weapon as a mace with a star-like shape at its head. Stars have points, points are pointy and can pierce, thus piercing damage. Meanwhile, the weapon itself uses blunt force so you're hitting someone with blunt force but also piercing them with the thorn-like pointy parts. See the wikipedia page for images. HolyGuardian80 (talk) 15:24, January 5, 2020 (UTC) Morningstars in NWN were chain weapons and years prior that is how I remember it, now more weapons are considered flails. (A chained morningstar would be useless at beating grain) Morningstars have also been considered a fabrication from hollywood, so look beyond the surface of information https://www.publicmedievalist.com/curious-case-weapon-didnt-exist/. Some maces are not star shaped and for piercing damage I would say something that penetrates the armor and internal organs, thorns would be insufficient. The longer spike on top of the spiked mace should be suitable for piecring damage. https://www.outfit4events.com/eur/product/5998-spiked-mace/ Ragimund (talk) 02:36, January 8, 2020 (UTC) All I'm trying to say is that it makes sense in my mind that morningstars (based on what morningstars are known as on wikipedia) deal both blunt and piercing damage. The article you linked is about flails. This talk page and my comment are both about morningstars. Thanks. HolyGuardian80 (talk) 07:37, January 8, 2020 (UTC)'' What flail? A flail is an agricultural tool used for threshing, the process of separating grains from their husks. It is usually made from two or more large sticks attached by a short chain (hinge); sometimes adapted for warfare but not a chain weapon. This page also isn't about a chained weapon, morningstars were chained weapons. Now many things are flails which they weren't and shouldn't be. Because a flail is 2 sticks hinged together. Ragimund (talk) 08:49, January 8, 2020 (UTC)''